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Post by RangersGM - (Mark) on Feb 24, 2010 13:24:19 GMT -5
I was wondering what the rest of the league thought about possibaly changing FA bidding to blind style. The are two reasons for why I think we should have the blind bidding, one is for the integrity of the league and the other just out of pure selfishness.
1. Integrity of the league - from my past experiances in Dynasty leagues, I have seen many many teams with alot of cap space and nothing to do with it just hike up the price on a FA that another GM did their due diligence on and is losing out on that player due to not enough cap room. I also feel like the player who is being bid on isnt necessary worth the high contract they will be awarded and the following year will just be dropped.
2. Pure sefishness - I dont know about anyone else here but it sure as hell bothers me when I due my research on some minor leaguers (or majors for that matter) and post a bid on them only two have 19 other GM's put in a bid based on my time spent doing the research.
I feel that if we do a blind style bidding than the actual contract values will be way more in line with what that player is actually worth.
Any thoughts?
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Post by RedSoxGM - (Kevin) on Feb 24, 2010 14:10:26 GMT -5
I was wondering what the rest of the league thought about possibaly changing FA bidding to blind style. The are two reasons for why I think we should have the blind bidding, one is for the integrity of the league and the other just out of pure selfishness. 1. Integrity of the league - from my past experiances in Dynasty leagues, I have seen many many teams with alot of cap space and nothing to do with it just hike up the price on a FA that another GM did their due diligence on and is losing out on that player due to not enough cap room. I also feel like the player who is being bid on isnt necessary worth the high contract they will be awarded and the following year will just be dropped. 2. Pure sefishness - I dont know about anyone else here but it sure as hell bothers me when I due my research on some minor leaguers (or majors for that matter) and post a bid on them only two have 19 other GM's put in a bid based on my time spent doing the research. I feel that if we do a blind style bidding than the actual contract values will be way more in line with what that player is actually worth. Any thoughts? On your points: (1) this is an age old argument in dynasty leagues which often leads to the discussion about certain free agent signing amounts having to be backed up with longer contract length (for instance, if you bid $10 million, you must sign him for 3 years, not just 1). In every league, I've been in it always comes right back around to "if you want the free agents, save the payroll for when they become available". I'm with you on this one Mark...I've just never seen a feasible solution that doesnt punish one side or the other. (2) I raised a similar question on this before: sdbaseball.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=rulesuggestions&action=display&thread=223Neal made some great points in his response. |
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Post by JaysGM - (Mat) on Feb 24, 2010 15:03:31 GMT -5
I was wondering what the rest of the league thought about possibaly changing FA bidding to blind style. The are two reasons for why I think we should have the blind bidding, one is for the integrity of the league and the other just out of pure selfishness. 1. Integrity of the league - from my past experiances in Dynasty leagues, I have seen many many teams with alot of cap space and nothing to do with it just hike up the price on a FA that another GM did their due diligence on and is losing out on that player due to not enough cap room. I also feel like the player who is being bid on isnt necessary worth the high contract they will be awarded and the following year will just be dropped. 2. Pure sefishness - I dont know about anyone else here but it sure as hell bothers me when I due my research on some minor leaguers (or majors for that matter) and post a bid on them only two have 19 other GM's put in a bid based on my time spent doing the research. I feel that if we do a blind style bidding than the actual contract values will be way more in line with what that player is actually worth. Any thoughts? On your points: (1) this is an age old argument in dynasty leagues which often leads to the discussion about certain free agent signing amounts having to be backed up with longer contract length (for instance, if you bid $10 million, you must sign him for 3 years, not just 1). In every league, I've been in it always comes right back around to "if you want the free agents, save the payroll for when they become available". I'm with you on this one Mark...I've just never seen a feasible solution that doesnt punish one side or the other. (2) I raised a similar question on this before: sdbaseball.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=rulesuggestions&action=display&thread=223Neal made some great points in his response. I'll never claim to know everything about the blind biding - as I've never used it - but I do believe that I've been a "casualty" of this in most of my leagues. Does it frustrate me? For sure. But, you can use that to your strategy as well. I never list the guys I actually want right away, always make sure that there is someone bigger on the board to draw interest away from my player, and always keep 3-4 players in reserve to make sure if I lose I gain. Also, people don't have endless amounts of money - so if you do as I did with Escobar and drive up the price to take up a majority of an owner's budget, you can always take advantage of "the next big thing" because there will always be "a next big thing". Either way I don't see it as being "fixable" and believe the system in place is adequate. If you really really want a player, you can do like Dan and trade away salary to outbid everyone else. If you really want a certain player and know you'll be the one to list him, free up enough salary first, then list him and have at'er. Going to a blind system seems more like a cop out to me that would take some of the fun away from the league bids. I personally love to see how we can waster money on some really overhyped prospects. I'm just as guilty as others, but it does add that tinge of excitement. Besides, people in the league know who's doing the digging and who's doing the buying.....so the credit is already out there anyhow. |
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Post by RedSoxGM - (Kevin) on Feb 24, 2010 15:53:57 GMT -5
I'll never forget one year I was in a $260 cap auction league, no keepers. A young Fernando Tatis was posted as an FA for a buck and then I went to two bucks on him. The third bid was $72 bucks because the guy had that much money left. I wanted to strangle the other owner. But I think he got 3 HRs out of Tatis that whole year.
We ave good owners in this league, with different strategies. I am open to discussion on any options though.
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Post by JaysGM - (Mat) on Feb 24, 2010 16:37:12 GMT -5
I'll never forget one year I was in a $260 cap auction league, no keepers. A young Fernando Tatis was posted as an FA for a buck and then I went to two bucks on him. The third bid was $72 bucks because the guy had that much money left. I wanted to strangle the other owner. But I think he got 3 HRs out of Tatis that whole year. We ave good owners in this league, with different strategies. I am open to discussion on any options though. lol, yeah, I have a home league that uses the 260 system (AL) and the big one I remember last year was BJ Upton getting bid up to $18 before one owner got over excited and bid $38. Needles to say he regretted it all season long. Question: If you were in an NL only 260 league, how much would you bid for Doc? |
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Post by O's GM - (Clay) on Feb 24, 2010 16:53:36 GMT -5
I've done both blind and auction. Both have their merits. There certainly is something nice about not announcing that you're targeting a specific player, particularly a minor. However, there's something about the auction style that is thrilling and frustrating at the same time. It's an adrenaline roller coaster. I kind of like it. I figure in 25 years when we're bald or grey BCN Pro will probably have to go to blind weekly or twice weekly bidding as they do in the SSDL...So, basically, I say keep it as is unless there's an outcry. But, maybe down the road someone can start up another satellite league with closed bids - just for sh*ts n giggles.
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Post by DiamondbacksGM - (Neal) on Feb 24, 2010 18:38:55 GMT -5
Mark, in regards to your statement that, "I also feel like the player who is being bid on isnt necessary worth the high contract they will be awarded and the following year will just be dropped."
The BIG difference between SSDL and BCN/Super dooper league is the waiver policy.
In SSDL players can be waived with a 20% salary penalty...so bidding $30M on Matt Holliday in a blind bidding process isn't that big a deal because you can cut him next season for only $3.1M.
If you won Holliday for $30M in BCN or here you would not be able to easily dispose of his contract. If you sign him to a multi-year deal you are pretty much stuck with his contract for the duration. If you cut him next year you are down $30M bucks pretty much.
In terms of minor leaguers....I HATE the secret bidding. There used to be a lot more activity on a daily basis in SSDL and I partially blame the silent milb auction for the decrease. With the old system everybody pretty much felt obligated to check in daily to make sure they weren't missing out on a prospect. As a byproduct, people checked their pm's and talked on the board more. Now that it is a weekly silent bid style the only day people are guaranteed to check in is on tuesday (the day results for milb players are announced). The strategy is also lessened. I only have 1-2 million in cap room left in that league but it doesn't matter to me at all. I already won 4-5 top prospects last week for the minnimum bids. No need to save money, no need to make trades to free up cash, no need to outmaneuver other managers for prospects.
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Post by O's GM - (Clay) on Feb 24, 2010 23:48:48 GMT -5
Neal, really good points regarding the closed minors bids. As for the tough waiver penalty, in BCN Pro, it's really been the consistent choice of the members. They've wanted it tough. Guess we'll see how it shakes out here. It's nice to just be able to sit and watch it all play out.
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Post by BravesGM - (?) on Feb 25, 2010 0:13:22 GMT -5
what do you guys mean when you say closed or secret bidding? sorry if i sound like an amateur.
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Post by dan on Feb 25, 2010 1:28:33 GMT -5
Yeah, I moved Wood to make a big bid on Chapman. Who knows how much of a blind bid it would have taken for me to secure Mr. Chapman's services in BCN PRO. I have to think it would have been less than $29 million, cause, it is INSANE to pay a prospect....any prospect....that much. But the auction process led to me paying that amount to get him and I happen to fully believe that the team with $29 million to spend and no one to spend it on (RedSox in BCN PRO) thought he was likely to end up with him. Then as the bidding entered the $20 million dollar range I saw on his trade block he was trying to move some players with bigger contracts likely to make more room to have more money than me to spend on Chapman. So I pounced, and bit the bullet and bid $29 million. That excitement would not have happened with a blind bid system. With a blind bid system I would have made one bid and checked in later when it was announced if I had won him or not. His auction lasted at least a couple of weeks and it was fun to watch....then partake in....then leave for a bit.....then jump back in on and then go INSANE!
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Post by DiamondbacksGM - (Neal) on Feb 25, 2010 2:28:33 GMT -5
Yeah, I moved Wood to make a big bid on Chapman. Who knows how much of a blind bid it would have taken for me to secure Mr. Chapman's services in BCN PRO. I have to think it would have been less than $29 million, cause, it is INSANE to pay a prospect....any prospect....that much. But the auction process led to me paying that amount to get him and I happen to fully believe that the team with $29 million to spend and no one to spend it on (RedSox in BCN PRO) thought he was likely to end up with him. Then as the bidding entered the $20 million dollar range I saw on his trade block he was trying to move some players with bigger contracts likely to make more room to have more money than me to spend on Chapman. So I pounced, and bit the bullet and bid $29 million. That excitement would not have happened with a blind bid system. With a blind bid system I would have made one bid and checked in later when it was announced if I had won him or not. His auction lasted at least a couple of weeks and it was fun to watch....then partake in....then leave for a bit.....then jump back in on and then go INSANE! lol. That was a classic auction. Great, great description on the benefits of open, non-secret bids. |
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Post by O's GM - (Clay) on Feb 25, 2010 3:44:01 GMT -5
what do you guys mean when you say closed or secret bidding? sorry if i sound like an amateur. In a closed bidding system, your bids are not seen by the other GM's. The league chooses a day(s) and time by which all free agent bids for the week/period must be submitted. For example, let's say every Sunday by 5PM. Bidding for the week would then close at 5PM with the next week's bids accepted beginning at 5:01. The players go to the team that made the highest closed or sealed bid. The bids go to either the commish or preferably an account created specifically to receive bids. Sometime Sunday night or before the start of play Monday, the commish posts all winning bids. Wash, rinse, repeat... |
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Post by BravesGM - (?) on Feb 25, 2010 9:01:48 GMT -5
what do you guys mean when you say closed or secret bidding? sorry if i sound like an amateur. In a closed bidding system, your bids are not seen by the other GM's. The league chooses a day(s) and time by which all free agent bids for the week/period must be submitted. For example, let's say every Sunday by 5PM. Bidding for the week would then close at 5PM with the next week's bids accepted beginning at 5:01. The players go to the team that made the highest closed or sealed bid. The bids go to either the commish or preferably an account created specifically to receive bids. Sometime Sunday night or before the start of play Monday, the commish posts all winning bids. Wash, rinse, repeat... i see why some GMs would like this, but I dont like it too much....lol |
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